False Patriotism in Time of War

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As a Vietnam vet and "Army Brat" who was raised in the service, I have agonized over this war and the way too many citizens have used false patriotism in its support.


So far the American and British casualties have been minimal, but we have no idea how many civilians have died. Saddam is dead or missing, but so what? He had been compromised and contained for a long time, at least since the inspections began. The Iraqi military has "surrendered," but terrorism will continue and we will lose more of our people to suicide attacks.


Around the world, violence against Americans will escalate. Achieving an effective and humane reconfiguration of Iraq will seriously stress resources that should be used at home. And the biggest issue of all still looms - how will the West, specifically America, resolve the eternal Israel-Palestine war. Even without the prodding of Prime Minster Blair, Bush must now demand that a homeland be created for the Palestinians with an immediate end of their own terrorism against Israel. Only such a major readjustment of our Middle East policy can help mitigate our initiation of a war that now places us, in Muslim eyes, as the true Evil Empire.


Meanwhile, back at home, what about those who continue to practice the ugly side of patriotism? I will be angry for a very long time over those who insist that "you are either for us or against us." We have heard once again the fascistic chant of "America - Love it or leave it." They just don't get it. There is no more important patriot in this nation than the citizen who has the guts to stand up and tell the official establishment that it is wrong, that it is forcing the nation to move in a dangerous direction. It is so deeply wrong to viciously attack the patriotism of those who dissent peacefully. From dissent has always come the forced consideration of options and the search for mitigation. There is nothing more American that the right, no, the responsibility, of honest, nonviolent expression of opinion.


Finally, it is so immature and embarrassing to our nation that tiny minds must even attack France and anything seemingly French. "Freedom Fries?" We trivialize ourselves. The French have been carrying the banner for an international view shared by the majority of the world. As distasteful as we may find French positioning, it is their right, it is their own national duty. It is no wonder that so much of the world looks upon Americans as self-absorbed primitives.


I know who my enemy is - it is the idiots who last month burned down the dry cleaning establishment I use here in Modesto, because it had the word French in its name (or because it had Assyrian owners who immigrated from the Middle East).


I know who I must fear the most - those Americans who do not understand what freedom of speech means, those who equate patriotism with blind obedience to what the current power structure tries to dictate. I care not what any individual wants to believe, though I may wish to debate issues with them. I care very much when anyone tries to strip me, or anyone else, of our right to be true to our convictions.
 
Grantt...Pretty good post from you for a change. I especially agree with the your "stated" position on the freedom of speech rights. However, why you think someone's support for this war, or this administration for that matter, should be considered "blind obedience" makes me wonder about that position. Debate is just debate. Doesn't mean those disagreeing with you are trying to "strip you of your right to be true to your convictions". Why does the freedom of speech or expression have to end with YOUR position? Why can't I have distaste for anything French right now? Why can't I express that distaste however I choose? Short of burning down businesses, of course
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. That kind of assinine "protest" (if you can call it that), is not exclusively American. American owned businesses abroad have been targeted for some time now. Just shows that extremists exist everywhere. And you are right...these are the ones that would squash your rights if given a chance. Again, these people are not exclusively "American". You state in one part of your post, the virtues of "peaceful dissent". I agree. But then you have a problem with an individual in opposition to the French point of view, call his fries "freedom fries". Can there be any more "peaceful dissent" than that? Beats the hell out of desecrating the graves of the soldiers that died saving your ancestors asses. I still need help in understanding why, as a U.S. citizen (assuming), you can disagree with a U.S. government position, but as a U.S. citizen in agreement with the governments policy, I can't disagree with YOUR position. Without of course, you feeling that I'm trying to strip your of your freedoms.
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True dat Judge. Just hope the (hopefully temporary) suspending of come civil liberties, due to the war on terror, isn't the start of the "selling" of that soul.
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Very good post Grantt! You hit on points I've expressed several times. In particular, civil disobedience being so important in our society.

Personal freedoms have been drastically reduced in the past few years. The novel "1984" looks less like fiction and more like reality all the time. Big brother is here, and I fear to stay.

Good post Razz, that's the most civility I've ever seen you express.
 

Where Taconite Is Just A Low Grade Ore
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I too am a viet vet, and as I see it the 2nd most worrysome person in this admin. is Ashcroft. I believe he is a real threat to the civil rights of ALL of us. He would gladly squash any dissent under the guise of "national interest". I know there will be some of you who have no problem w/his policy on certain unregistered aliens, i.e. holding them incommunicado indefinately. But this tactic is the first step towards repressive action against ANY who disagree. Used by many such governments over the years. Not by free & open societies!

I love my country but fear my government.
 

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Good post Grantt. It does seem like many of those who were in favor of the war went beyond honest disagreement to trying to attack the patriotism, decency and motives of the dissenting voices. It's basically the conservative take on political correctness. Liberals take offense when you insult animals, the environment, poor people, etc...conservatives take offense when you criticize their wars. I believe Bill Maher termed it 'patriotic correctness' which is an apt term.
 

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My brother has fought in two wars in the middle east in the last twelve years and he says - Lets kick some ass where ass deserved to be kicked. He's a republican like myself and a true bad ass fighter. He could care less what the left has to say here in America. So screw you left wing cry babies! We have good leaders presently in the white house with Bush so lets go for it - Yeah baby!!!! lefties - get a job. Quit feeding off my tax dollars like a two month old baby and most of all get a ****in brain to go with your little panzy ass heart.
 

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JP,a truely stupid post.Wanna kick my ass?I'll be in NY,Pitt, and Balt. in June.BTW,I have always worked and always paid taxes.Probably more than you.
 

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Judge. Talk about a stupid post. I'm sorry you have to pay more taxes than myself. Some say thats a good problem to have. You really want to kick my ass? I'll let my brother continue kicking the Iraqi's asses and the al-Queda as well. I would never want to go to NY or Baltimore to kick the ass of someone who has helped on occasion in the sportsforum. I don't go looking for fights Judge. neither does this republican party.
 

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JP,I don't either,it just pisses me off that because my beliefs lean toward the left you would assume that I am a pussy.Btw we are in agreement that mine was a stupid post.Just the Irish in me.
 

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I am to young to remember nam but my Dad was in nam and he is a republican and is all for taking out these commie countries.

Can anyone tell me how the Patriot act has effected them personally?

Thanks,
KMAN
 

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Judge,

Don't worry your response was justified, jp's was much dumber.

BTW, I lean left like Judge and have worked since I was 12 and have always paid my taxes. Lefties are pussies, I would say the way jp goes around calling people pussies on the internet, and has already admited his brother is the soldier, we can see who the pussy is.
 

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Judge,
I guess we got something in common.
I have trouble keeping my Irish temper in check at times too.
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I am not blindly in favor of war or shooting people. I hate guns.

Saddam has tortured and killed millions YES MILLIONS of Iraquis during his 35 years of power. It is solely due to the wisdom and strength of George W. Bush that the rule of the madman has quickly and easily been ended.

Sasddam has killed 1,000,000+ in his rule. Those who piss and moan about the war are stupid. His time was over. The Iraqi people thank Bush and I will as well.

Vietnam is over. It was over 28 years ago. Do not compare further conflicts to it. Lessons are learned from each war and each war is different. Liberating Iraq is a world changing event. There is no downside. Bush is a geniuos, what a wonderful leader we have.......
 

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